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Re: songwriters and geography trivia

Layne Petersen wrote:

> [...] i'm editing cuz I didn't want to respond
> to every point made and I want to (at least a little bit) conserve space.

I do the same thing! LOL

> But it kinda does accurately represent Dobson. [...]

okay if you feel that way. I don't ever get the impression listening to him that he condones
'gaybashing' and things.. saying someone feels like something is wrong and standing on that is different
from encouraging or condoning 'ungodly' responses to those things. And saying that he shouldn't make a
stand on the beliefs that he holds is saying we don't have the 'fifth amendment' right. (isn't that the
one?)

> [...] I mean, Christ Himself told the
> ol' religious guys that the ones who hadn't sinned themselves could be the first ones to pick up a
> stone in the aforementioned story of the woman caught in adultery. So, before I can say word one,
> Ineed to make sure I haven't done something wrong myself. Which isn't ever the case.

and still, the instance with the woman caught in adultery. After he said "who ever has committed no sin
pick up the first stone" he was in the place where he could have thrown it, but he turned to her and
said "where are they that condemn you? neither do I condemn you. go and sin no more"

> [...] I think "in no ways tolerated what she was doing" is a bit harsh. He told her to not do it, but
> I
> think He also realized that the choice was up to her.

yes, the choice was up to her but that didn't change the fact that he in no way tolerated what she was
doing. You have your choice. but that doesn't change the truth. sin is sin.

BY THE WAY. I have had it brought to my attention that I didn't totally explain myself.
It was said by someone (should I keep you annonymous?) in an email to me...
"Jesus is a very personal saviour. whereas one might need to recieve a good "yelling," i think he knows
what each individual *needs.* [...] Christ may deal with sin harshly, but He is a compassionate saviour
above all."

And I 100% agree. in the same way that Jesus didn't tolerate sin he was still very sensitive to how he
shared it and was different with every person. he is always there and doesn't leave you because of that.

>  but you are taking extremes here [...]
>
> I like Amy's point here about all Arabs not being terrorists. I feel a lot of the time like all of
> us Christians are perceived as blind sheep who will follow at any cost and do things of extreme
> stupidity without thinking of the consequences (like blowing up abortion clinics, etc). Which 99% of
> the time isn't the case.

thank you.

> [...] But I think the point that's being made is that there isn't a common factor with the
> "non-Christian wackos" like there is with the "Christian wackos". Far too many people are doing some
> pretty crazy crap "in the name of Jesus."

too many. but to say we are the *only* ones is a one sided issue. that is what I was confronting. no
christian should do anything of the sort. ever. period.  killing anyone in the name of Jesus/God is
wrong. always. Jesus would NEVER do it and so neither should we. murder is murder, etc.

> [...] about holy text y.
>
> Yes, it is hypocritical. But a lot of the wackos seem to think it's along the lines of civil
> disobedience to make some huge stand against the evils of society. Like bombing a clinic. And I
> guess that does mean that they're reading the Bible and saying "I don't care what it says. The lives
> of babies are more important."

which is wrong.

> When it comes down to it, Christ is our example.

yes.

> [...] He wasn't the big political activist that groups like Dobson's seem to want to
> make Him out to be.

I tend to disagree. what I read in the Bible tells me that Jesus was very much a political activist.
meaning that he confronted the issues of the day and tore into the wrongness of them. Espeically with
the 'religious' leaders. who by the way, were very much leaders in that day as a society as a whole. In
fact, Jesus was nearly stoned because of 'political' reasons. and he was also tried in a Roman court and
crucified becuase of 'political' issues. whether or not they were 'religious' political reasons or not.

> When I open my copy of the Denver Post and read about how James Dobson is making
> another big political stand claiming that he'll tell his listeners to pull their support from the
> Republican party if they don't make some official stand on abortion, it makes me ill. Being a
> follower of Christ doesn't put you into a particular ideology.

but, if you go on the basic assumption (as most do), that republicans represent the christian view, then
it would be fair to say they need to make a stand on it. and there is nothing wrong saying you should
pull your support if they don't agree with what you stand on. I am a republican, but I don't vote a
straight ballot becuase sometimes the democrats have better beliefs and values than the republicans.

> It just means you believe He was who He said He was and you go from there.

By saying you believe who he says he was also means taht you commit your life to living in that
lifestyle and are walking a lifestyle like Jesus. That means that you will take stands on political
issues or you we as 'usa' wouldn't even be there. cause people came to america as a way of breaking free
from england. again, making a political stand. So I would say that your statement needs to go one step
further and say "being a christian means that you believe who he says he was and you spend your life
trying to live and do what he did." as Paul says in phillippians "I want to know Christ and the power of
his resurrection and the fellowship of sharing in his sufferings, becoming like him in his death, so I
may attain to the resurrection from the dead"

okay. thanks for all the comments and the challenging of my brain. I appreciate it and it is making my
think about some of my beleifs and changing my mind in some areas.

Sorry to any listies who are not interested in this conversation. If you want us to quit just say and we
will take it off the list and go through private emails...

Amy
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