Re: Radio whom?? (stuff about prayer)

["J. Marie Hall" <fionaeval at yahoo_com>]

hi ryan and list,

> First, of
> course God is "behind" 
> whatever action He wants done in the physical world.

sure...i wasn't contradicting this idea...only the
idea that he "needs" a natural, physical being/person
to enact his deeds, however supernatural many of them
might be.

> commands.  Also, God must have "thought" the world
> into existence and 
> there's no way I'm gonna even try and explain that
> one.

that's supernatural action though.  plus, he actually
_spoke_ it into being--as i think all sociolinguists
will agree, that's definite action.

> Second, I don't 
> know what you by the following:
> 
> >---> i don't think he needs anything, but i think
> it's
> >his relational/love character that makes free moral
> >agency a real part of the experience.

i meant that we do not meet some "need" in him (the
way we generally think of needs)...he would not be
incomplete without us (in terms of some power in our
agency).

yes, i believe he is desperate for us but that he
loves powerfully b/c of the intrinsic nature of his
being.  it's who he is...not b/c we're so great or
anything :)  but yet he made us precious.

i think the point i'm trying to make is about where
the glory points in any aspect or offshoot of any
issue related to god and/or us.

> things, but there is also the passage stating "You
> receive not because you 
> ask not."

i've been thinking about this, and i believe it
doesn't contradict the idea that prayer is more for
us.  that we ask not could be the fruit of a lack of
awareness or acceptance of our outright need.

in the beatitudes, jesus talks about the poor of
spirit.  this poverty has to do with an honest
humility that recognizes it's utter and essential need
(not with a lack of depth in spirit).

maybe we do not receive b/c we are not in a place to. 
our petition is a verbal assertion of that need that
is perhaps more beneficial to us than to the god of
the universe (in terms of needs being met).  i think
he's pretty aware of our need :)  that _we_ know it is
imperative if we are to receive from him.

and that's a question of position (and in part with
repentance--very much tied to the humility etc).  if
you want to give me a present, i have to be facing
you, near you, with my arms outstretched and/or hands
open, physically able to take it from your hands.

as it is with god, i have to be repentant/humble/aware
of my need (repent means to turn and go the other way,
towards god)--facing him, desiring him (arms
outstretched etc.)/near him (he will draw near to us
if we draw near to him)...so it's a position thing.

prayer helps us do that.  just as god has creative and
redemptive power in his words, i think there is
something very powerful about our own.  even our
groans :)

just a few  more cents,
j. marie

=====
All human nature vigorously resists grace because grace changes us and the change is painful. -Flannery O'Connor

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References:

• Re: Radio whom?? (was Radio Satan)
• From: "ryan richards" <randomricky at hotmail_com>

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