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Re: Flame stirring



--- Iron Curtain <ubiquitiousone at yahoo_com> wrote:
> john davis <hellomynameisj at yahoo_com> wrote:
> 
> >i remember once i
> >ordered a boxed set for my friend meighan's
> birthday.
> >you guys sent it in a lovely wooden cigar box,
> wrapped
> >it up and wrote her name in lovely caligraphy on
it.
> >when she opened it, it was like finding a treasure
> or a
> >secret box of mysteries that once released, would
> >change the world forever.
> 
> I would like to suggest that everyone take a moment
> and think about
> who actually does this sort of thing.  Do 
> you really think that Linford and Karin are
packaging
> up orders and
> mailing them out with tender loving 
> care? 

no. don't be silly. but that's the whole *point,* isn't
it? do you know that paintings like leonardo's "last
supper" and michaelangelo's cisitine chapel painting
were not done entirely by the respective artists? they
had apprentices who did a lot of the work- the intial
design and methodology belong to michaelangelo and
leonardo (and donatello and rapheal and splinter - GO
NINJA TURTLES!!!!)
to me, the folks who are 'behind the scenes" make up
OtR in a big way. any of you who remember shelly can
attest to the fact that she was as much a part of the
OtR "experience" (for lack of a better word) as anyone
else.
the stagehands, the soundman, that really cool guy with
the beard who runs the CD/t-shirt/poster table at shows
(i don't know his name. anybody?). every show i've been
to (three- one in nashville tn, one rhinelander
roundup, one at schuba's in chicago) has had this same
table set-up, with great care placed into the aesthetic
appearance of the table- that nifty old book "flyboys
over the rhine" on display, etc. now, as to whether
linford or karin of brian or whoever "made" the table
setup- who cares? doesn't it say something about the
band if they have such talented, giving people who put
such care into their work, even if it be manning a
product table at shows, working for them? (i know, i
know, that was a big comma splice...)
who cares if linford actually did it himself. he
doesn't have to. he didn't make any of the websites for
OtR- they have all been volunteer sites. yet the sites
really reflect OtR- doesn't that maen something?
doesn't that mean that linford's and karin's and ric's
and brian's original "vision" has caught on, whatever
the heck that vision is?





> I would say, based on observations of personnel
> changes over the
> years, that it's a pretty safe bet that the 
> person who packaged said cigar box with such loving
> care is no longer
> working with Over the Rhine.  Seems 
> like none of the original cast of support characters
> is (the Todds,
> the Don, the Donna - how many of you even 
> know who Donna is?, the Shelly, the Ric, the
> Mike...).  Whether the
> decision to leave is made by them, or by 
> Linford, I can't begin to guess.  

eh? what are you trying do with *that* statement? does
linford (or anybody) have to answer to you about
his/her hiring policy? 




> 
> Also, why is it no one here seems to be the least
bit
> offended that
> Linford would solicit membership in a 
> one-year club which would provide four-newsletters
> and various other
> items and not deliver?  

ahem. i beleive you're drifting from your original
point into some personal attack. i suggest that if you
have a problem with the way linford or anyone at OtR
has handled the rhinelander cluib memebership, write to
them. 

i, for one, think that for my 20 bucks, i got a good
deal:
1 "besides" cd. ($15 value)
2 rhinelander shows around christmastime ($20-25 dollar
value)
3 northern spy issues, one of which was a big, long
letter from linford. ($5 value- hard to put a price on
this one)
a ten percent discount on any OtR mechandise. (in this
alone, i've made my 20 bucks back.)





He certainly 
> cashed my check quickly enough.  How many years has
> our one-year
> membership now spanned?  

and you're *complaining* about this?


> 
> Here's my smarmy response that you are sure to find
> offensive:  'Thank
> heavens.  Finally someone who 
> hasn't yet been indoctrinated into the "Linford: 
> Poet for the Masses,
> Thinker of Great Thoughts, Friend of 
> Small Animals and Fans" school of thought.'

i *suppose* that, if you *want* to, you can treat
linford, or anyone in OtR, of any artist, or any
short-order cook at mcdonalds as merely someone who is
prividing you with a service, a part of a big, long
chain of workers deisgned to get your product to you.

but i, for one, find our consumerist society to be
rather abusive, and i refuse to treat people like
that.



> 
> I also find it interesting that people were so
> offended when
> 'white.ce.2' wrote that Linford and Karin should 
> use contract players, yet when Linford says that
> they're going to be
> playing as Linford, Karin and Jack no one says "hey,
> what about the
> rest of the band?"  Brian has been around longer
than
> anyone but
> Linford 
> (yes, even longer than Karin) - doesn't anyone
wonder
> what the deal is
> with him?  What about Terri?  
> What about whoever it is they have playing bass
since
> Mike left?  (I
> personally believe that 'left' is faulty 
> word choice but that's how it has been presented to
> us, so be it.)

you like to throw accusations around, huh? FYI- Mike
sent us a letter recently, explaining that he was in a
great jazz band and giving us inof on how to get his
music. i think that OtR has treated thier former
members with oodles of respect. they don't have to
advertise for Monk or Mike. but they take time in thier
emailsto us to do so.


> 
> What is OTR to you?  

a band. they make music. it touches me. it touches
other people. i find that a lot of the other people it
touches are kind of like me in some ways. i write them
emails on this list. i meet them at shows.

as someone pointed out (becca, her name was) yesterday,
it's hard, so hard, to find a good community. it's hard
to find other artists, musicians, who i can really
identify with. OtR's music is much more to me than a
product. it's become aprt of who i am, and if i sound
like a fanatic, then find yourself a cross and hang me
on it or throw me to some lions or burn me at a stake
or make fun of me or whatever.

"if all the world is but a story, it would be best for
you to chose the most enduring story." - St. Columba.

to me, OtR comes close to telling the story i've been
longing to hear. not just with their music,  but with
everything- all the stuff discussed above and more. if
you don't like the story, that's cool, but please don't
ridicule those of who have let the sotry begin to tell
us about ourselves.




> 
> What if I am Brian?  What if I am Todd?  What if I
am
> Linford?  What
> if I am Shelly?  What if I am Jo?  What if I am Ric?

> What if I am
> Donna?  What if I am just another lurker?  What if I
> am Chris?  What
> if I am Bink?  What if?  How does knowing who I am
> make your reaction
> to what I have said any different?  If you'd like to
> discuss this in
> more depth feel free to email me directly, I will
> respond.

sorry- you presented this in public forum, and that's
where it stays. if you were any of the above, my first
inkling is that you wouldn't need to resort to such
tactics. if you are someone listed above, then i
wonder, if perhaps you ought to go talk directly to
whoever it is in OtR you have a problem with and try to
work it out, rather than attempting to stir dissention
among us. *we* didn't do anyhting to you. if you hae a
prbolem with linford, talk to the man. work it out. be
a force for positivity instead of continuing violence.

but don't try to poison our experience.

john.


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