Re: Collaboration

[michelle <kanani71 at yahoo_com>]

> For all the time Jack spent with them, I never got
> the sense that he 
> ever had the freedom (or perhaps even desire) to shape the
> band's sound beyond 
> playing the music that had been written for him to play.  

> they were trying 
> to encourage sales of his CD, but why weren't any of those
> fabulous songs of 
> his taken and made an Over the Rhine song?  He was, in effect,
> a part of OtR 
> for what, 6 or 7 years?  And how much input did he have in
> that entire time?  
> What would his performances have been like if he'd been able
> to take possession 
> of the songs as more than just a glorified session musician?


i'm quite positive i'm not qulalified to have this opinion,
seeing them only twice and hearing a small handfull of bootlegs
w/ jack, but i'm going to go w/ your parenthesis option of him
not having the desire.  it always seemed to me like jack's
involvement with OtR was always a coming together of friends for
him.  he just wanted to play and more that playing w/ OtR
allowed him to focus on his own songwriting and put out 'Cheap
Tattoo' yet still get to jam w/his buddies and have some income.
 the picture of them in the Grey Ghost in the center of FFR's
leaflet almost sums up what i think of jack being part of OtR in
that 'pictures talk' way.  i love that picture.   


> Look, I'm not one of those hardcore old-timers who saw OtR
> play at Sudsy's 
> and swore that anything they would do without Brian and Ric
> would be crap.  


it's like you say steve, we had one great band, and now we have
two. ;)


> Karin and Linford have more than shown that they certainly
> can and do make 
> wonderful music and craft beautiful songs just by themselves,
> but I've really 
> felt that they're missing out on the collaborative element
> that a true "band" can bring.  


i get you on this, but at the same time i feel that they sponge
up so much of what's going on around them and in them regarding
other people and events - so maybe other players, be it
part-time or full-time, don't contribute to the writing of
songs, but their presence and contributions could add something
to some of what K&L do write or how they might picture it coming
out on tape (results that almost always suprise them as they've
said in interviews).  but i'm not saying that i think
contributions outside K&L wouldn't be a good thing or welcomed
or spruce a song up.  i don't know, i don't see karin writing
'when i go' and thinking of how the players fit in.  but
listening to 'show me' i can, or even 'whatever you say' - not
that that's the case, but i can see where it could be.

i'm just one of those fans who is completely woo'd by their
music and i could easily have typed nonsense and bullshit here,
but it is a little of what i think when i think about OtR and
jack and K&L as songwriters.  and for the record, i'm gonna miss
that floppy feller from scotland's presence next time i'm an
audience member.   


> I think it's a good thing that a) 
> this new drummer had the freedom to come up with a new way of
> doing a song, 
> b) was able to push for it to be recorded, and c) it was
> ultimately included on the album. I just think it bodes well
for 
> the creative health of Over the Rhine if there are more than 2
> people involved in the creative process.


i think it's a good/cool thing too.  and i really liked your
post.  a good "think about that.." one for the day.


> 
> Thanks for bearing with what is, without a doubt, the longest
> thing I've ever written to this list.


heck, i'd applaud.. but you wouldn't hear it.  ;)


michelle




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